Peter: In his Rolling Stone review of Bob Dylan’s Self Portrait album, Greil Marcus famously began, “What is this shit?” I think it is only fitting to begin our talk with that very same question. Tyler, tonight, we’re doing the John Lennon/Yoko Ono joint Some Time In New York City. I know you have an appreciation for Beatle solo albums. Fans of the show will know we’ve talked about George Harrison’s 1979 album George Harrison, and Paul McCartney’s 1978 album London Town, but you were not familiar with this one ahead of time?

Tyler: I knew the reputation.  It was so bad that I never bothered to give the thing a listen as an adult. There may have been a perfunctory play-through back in the youthful days when I’d check out Beatle cassettes from the library, but that’s as far as my experience with this one goes.

Peter: Things are getting real, people! This is Tyler’s first time hearing this album! It’s like reality TV, except, this, instead.

Tyler: Live!  On paper!  Well, a screen!  Avatar numbers await.

I suppose we should note to our people that we’re doing this chat in real time.  Typical Writers’ Loom practice for these conversations is to spend time with the music in the week(s) leading up to the discussion.  This time around, though, we’re getting all manner of crazy and listening raw as we write.

Peter: It takes time to put these things together, people!

But not this time.

Tyler: Like that one episode of Roc, we’re going live.

Peter: I don’t know how you typically prepare for our talks, but I normally listen to the whole album 3 or 4 times all the way through. Usually in fits and starts. I’ll look the album up on Wikipedia and read the Allmusic review. That sort of thing.

Tyler: My usual method is to toss the record into whatever’s my current heavy rotation, going through the songs as cohesively as I can, considering time and life barriers.  As for reading about the work, I effort to go in lean, no research beyond what I know before we talk.

Peter: Even though this was supposed to be a “First Listen/Initial Reaction” kind of a deal, I knew this album going in. It’s why I suggested it as an album we could do without a lot of pre-gaming. I’d heard it at some point back in the day, and it was a one and done situation for me. I did not like it at all.  So, the idea was, we were going to sort of hear it together for the first(ish) time. Which, in retrospect, seems like a great plan. But I’ll be honest, I listened to this several times in the past week because I can’t not do the homework. And, lordy… We’re in for a wild ride.

Tyler: You cheat!  You louse!

Just kidding.  At least we have your warnings to set my expectations.  And it sounds like those expectations should be even lower than they already are.

Peter: I am a cheat, though! Okay, one more thing, before we get started. My feelings about Yoko Ono are complicated. I’d say I’m neither a fan nor a “hater.” I think the idea that she broke up The Beatles is silly. Beyond that, I don’t think she’s devoid of talent, but, in general, I’m not a fan of her music.

And, she’s on here a lot! It’s not Double Fantasy, but it’s close.

Tyler: I don’t like Yoko.  She didn’t break up the band.  But she catered to John’s mother issues, all while being so controlling that she even dictated John’s mistress when John and Yoko separated, the much-maligned era when John decamped to Los Angeles to party with Nilsson and Ringo and assorted other cats known as the “Hollywood Vampires.”  She reeled him back in after John tidied up and recorded Walls And Bridges.  It’s all a real mess.

There are tell-alls out there with less-than-admiring things to say about Yoko.  Lots of speculation and whispering about what bad habits she may have indulged or encouraged.  Let’s not open ourselves up to libel by listing them.

Peter: Okay, you’re not wrong. I agree with almost everything you said. I’ve read some of those books. I was trying to be diplomatic! No, um, she seems to have meant something to some very cool female voices who came after her, and for that, we can be thankful.

Tyler: That’s a very fair point.  Plenty of artists love Yoko.

Peter: Okay, are you ready? Should we start?

Tyler: I’ll go ahead and queue this up.  Shudder.

Peter: Here we go!

This track has a racial slur in the title.

Tyler: God almighty, I haven’t pressed play and I’m, as ever, annoyed and disgusted by the title of the first song.

And with that, here we go.  Horns!  Bombast!  Wall of sound!  It’d all be so promising if not for the outrageous lyrics.

Peter: Obviously, this hasn’t aged well. It actually caused controversy at the time, as well, so it’s not a matter of being “woke” or anything like that.

Tyler: This is depressing.

For the sake of the uninformed, I suppose it’s an obligation to note that the title we’re lamenting is “Woman Is The N–– Of The World.”  No, it’s not okay.

Peter: Even way back in 1972 it wasn’t okay for a white guy to use the N word. It’s really, really, not okay today. Yoko actually coined the phrase (not saying that makes it better).

Tyler: Oh, of course she did.

Peter: This was the single! They wanted it played on the radio! It flopped hard. This album was both a critical and commercial disaster. It really marks a turning point in John’s career. For many years, he’d been driving the zeitgeist, but after this, his days as a taste-maker were over.

Tyler: When we discussed Wings, you correctly noted that Paul had no creative match in that band who could say “No, man, that ain’t it.” I feel similarly here, in that somebody needed a heavy hand to tell John “Let’s develop our own thoughts.”

Peter: The lyrics are just embarrassing.

Tyler: I’m cycling back to the start.  “Yes she is.  Think about it.”  Yep, just thought about it, Johnny!  Gong gong gong.

This reminds me of the Chris Rock bit about how enthusiastically white hip-hop listeners holler that word while rapping along without Black friends present.

“Woman is a slave to the slaves!”

Peter: Yeah. Not great.

Tyler: Okay, I gave that one two listens.  Sweet Jesus.

Peter: He was coming off Imagine, which was a big hit, after the relative commercial disappointment of John Lennon/Plastic Ono Band. He was stung by George’s success with All Things Must Pass, and Imagine was an attempt to get back on top. And it worked! The album went to number 1. But, he followed it up with this…

Tyler: I alluded a little to the music sounding good.  And it really doesn’t sound that bad, as early-‘70s John solo LPs go.  It’s over-the-top but not too far removed from George’s legendary All Things Must Pass.  Jinx!

Peter: Right! Both John and George used noted murderer, Phil Spector, as a producer. And that is reflected in the sound here (and on ATMP).

Tyler: One of these days I’m gonna cave and write some lame thinkpiece about how we choose what monsters’ art we allow ourselves to enjoy.

But not today!  Today we’ve got some Yoko for ya!

Peter: “Sisters, O Sisters.”

This song is terrible.

Tyler: …”male chauvinist pig engineer.”  Off to a roaring start here with the banter.

Peter: It’s all so heavy handed.

Tyler: The intro just led into the song.  This is like beach-party girl-group lunacy.

Peter: I learned from Wikipedia that this song was supposed to be a reggae track but the backing band, Elephant’s Memory, couldn’t play reggae.

Yoko’s not a good singer. Whatever else you think about her. We should all be able to agree on that.

Tyler: See, there you go.  John was slapdicking around New York with a bunch of nobodies like these guys.  You’re John Lennon!  This isn’t progressive, it’s just drugged-up idiocy.

Yoko’s delivery of the chorus grates the soul.

Peter: He could have called Clapton, Harrison, Ringo, Klaus Voormann, Nicky Hopkins. Instead he got these clowns.

Tyler: I did “Woman Is…” twice.   Can I handle “Sisters” again?

I’d be happy to move on.  That was miserable.

Peter: Yes. Let’s move on.

“Attica State.”

Tyler: There’s a groove here for ten seconds.  Then John starts singing.

Seven seconds.

Lord, this is not good.

What a bummer all of this is. What a waste of energy, talent and time.

Peter: The lyrics are like if Spinal Tap wrote a “political” album in 1972.

“Attica State, Attica State/We’re all mates with Attica State.”

Tyler: “We’re all mates with Attica State?”  That sounds like an ad for Aussie auto insurance company Attica State Farm.

Peter: It’s not good, but things are about to get worse!

Tyler: Oh, God’s sakes.

Peter: “Born In A Prison.”

Tyler: More sax.  The Fabs loved them some sax.

My face turns with mortified disgust.

Peter: It’s so bad.

So much sax!

Tyler: “Born In A Prison.”  Sounds like a fucking hair-metal band trying to get serious.  And now she’s singing “Born in a prison!!” over and over in the distant background.  Another non-profundity from Yoko.

As I wonder what Black listeners think of “Woman Is…”, I wonder what actual prisoners would think of this nonsense.

Peter: Sometimes I play this song as a joke if my wife is in the room. I also do that with “Sisters, O Sisters” but this one takes a little longer to register which makes it land harder.

Tyler: Again with “mates.”  Did Elephant’s Memory say that word a lot?

Peter: As bad as the studio versions are, there are live versions of these songs, and they are way, way worse.

Tyler: Oh good!

Peter: “New York City.”

Tyler: I knew this one a little.  I’m sorry to say.

David Peel.  This dude wandered the streets of NYC singing—atonally—about weed.  And he’s in a Beatles song!  He was on Apple!

Peter: This is a sort of Chuck Berry-esque rock and roller. The lyrics are less didactic than the other songs here, but it just doesn’t gel into anything. Yes! And John was obsessed with that guy!

Tyler: The “Que pasa New York!  Que pasa New York!” bit make me physically recoil.

“God’s a red herring in drag.”  Simply stunning.

Peter: It is stunning!

Wikipedia: “Garry Mulholland of Uncut magazine has described Some Time in New York City as ‘a contender for the worst LP by a major musical figure, its list of ’70s left-wing clichés hamstrung by the utter absence of conviction within the melodies and lyrics.'”

How could he have so badly misjudged the zeitgeist? He’s badly out of step here. People were tired of politics. They were ready for Ziggy Stardust.

The times they were a-changing!

Tyler: Mashing in “the PlasticOnoEl’phant’sMem’ry band” like we’re not gonna notice.

Those words don’t fit, John.  No, John.  No, John, don’t touch the hot stove!  <sizzle>

Peter: Yes. The words don’t fit. That happens a lot on this album. Trying to fit too much wisdom into pop songs.

Tyler: On the heels of Imagine, no less.  That album is rich with fine, unadorned, thoughtful words.

Peter: Good God, we’re only five songs in. It goes on like this! It’s a double album!

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